the_dunk_tank

The war started years ago between Ukraine and the separatists, and they reached a cease-fire, and Ukraine violated that cease-fire which is what promoted Russian intervention.

I don't have too strong of an opinion about what the ideal outcome looks like. But I believe that possible diplomatic solutions have been ignored or torn up. I believe that the US, because of the military industrial complex, has pressured Ukraine into more aggressive and intransigent approaches, to the detriment of the Ukrainian people. For example, Ukraine has staunchly refused to consider any territorial concessions, including Crimea which they haven't controlled since before the ceasefire.

Personally, I think the most realistic scenario that minimizes casualties in the short term, as well as having the best chance at peace in the long term, would be if Ukraine cedes the disputed provinces to Russia. But mostly I just don't want the people of Ukraine and Russia to keep getting fed into this stupid meat grinder just to move a line on a map. Maybe there's a solution where the provinces remain in Ukraine but are given a special degree of autonomy, and everyone agrees to play nice. Maybe they can agree to a ceasefire while a referendum is held, overseen by some neutral third party. I think we've probably passed a point where those two are realistic possibilities, but the point is there should be some willingness to compromise and negotiate. Demanding Russia's immediate withdrawal from all occupied territories is just not realistic. They've been trying to do it their way and all it's gotten is getting a bunch of people killed and no closer to a solution. Maybe it's time for somebody to sit down at a table.

What would the ideal outcome be according to you all? Ukraine should give up all the Russian speaking parts or cede the whole country?

Yes. It would save a ton of lives and damage NATO and the West.

As shit as Ukraine is Russia seems even worse.

NATO and the entire West is way worse.

Not the both-sides. Yes Ukraine should give up all non-Ukrainian parts and be put under an international (sans the west) force dedicated to denazification.

There's been a few of these threads for the last couple of days. I think the propagandists are working.