this post was submitted on 25 Feb 2025
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When it comes to hosting instances, yes, I do believe we have to universally keep investors/a for-profit structure out.
Putting these two in the same bag is a mistake, this is what OP and I are saying.
Context and scale matters. Even though both small and big companies depend "on profit", the methods they use and incentives that drive them are wildly different.
That’s a ridiculous statement. Context is just a malleable term you can use for whatever. Nobody is saying context is irrelevant, you can’t remove context from any statement.
Scale however does not matter.
Of course the scale of the business matters. If scale doesn't matter, a bunch of farmers selling their produce at a local market would be bad for their local community as Walmart.
You’re making a lot of inferences that allow you to be as myopic or broad as you want. You do not have a consistent view that has been laid out here. You’re just speaking in grand terms that are easy to defend no matter what. I didn’t say “local farmers at the farmers’ market” are the same as corporations, I’m saying scale is irrelevant because profit motive corrupts other values. You’re falling into the same hand wavy bullshit that people who go “but small businesses” fall into, as if those businesses aren’t exploiting people just as frequently as large corporations
Make an actual point.
And OP and I are saying that this generalization is shortsighted. You end up putting on the same bag:
By treating them as equal because "both of them are seeking profit", you are left with an economic system that is unable to grow to match the demands of the people.
I did, many times. It's just that you don't want to hear it.
The point is "Community is not enough" (I did link to the blog post, didn't I?) and I've been saying since 2022 that the Fediverse will not be able to grow until is dominated by this belief "that every profit-seeking business is bad and therefore should be rejected".
You can be mad at me all you want, you can be upset at this sad reality all you want, you can cry in a pillow all you need, but you can not say that the Fediverse has been a success story. We've had so many opportunities handed out to us to take this place and grow to become a viable alternative for everyone but we squander it every time because the loud minority of ideologues keep screaming "no businesses here!".
OP can speak for themselves. I am talking to you.
Yes farmers and Walmarts have some features they share. Same with everyone on that list. Are you saying they don’t? That they are completely different top to bottom?
I didn’t want to make those absurd arguments but you keep doing this nonsense. You keep being completely absolute in your language and trying to make me sound unreasonable. But I can easily paint you as someone doing the exact same thing in the opposite direction. So do you want this conversation to be productive or not?
I am not angry so I’m not sure what I’ve said that deserved that patronizing aside. We are both using the same tone. Do you need to calm down? Are you angry?
If you are not angry, you are certainly reading as someone who is facing an amygdala hijack. Your responses do not seem as someone who is collected and you do not seem willing to listen to what others are trying to express.
Case in point:
You are right, we are talking only about the features they share (i.e, profit-seeking) and whether this means that they should be treated equally. I didn't say they were completely different. But do they have to?
Let me try again: you are asserting that a small-scale farmer who works out on their own volition and makes a living by selling their produce at a higher price that it cost them (i.e, seeking profit) is a net-negative to society and as unethical as a huge corporation like Walmart. You are saying "the scale doesn't matter, any one working looking for profit is bad". Is this correct or am I misrepresenting you?
I’m not going to continue chatting with someone giving me absurd diagnoses just because I disagreed with them on the internet.
This is a very inappropriate and offensive thing to say to someone just because you disagree with them. It’s a strange conclusion to jump to as your top explanation and I sure hope this isn’t something you say to people’s faces and is just the result of how you behave online.
Have a good one. Don’t bother responding to me unless having the last word is that important to you. That was messed up and you are a very rude person to do something like that.
Look, I am sorry. I didn't mean to offend you and I didn't mean to "diagnose you". You asked me why I was responding as if you are angry, and I tried to illustrate how your responses are sounding on this side of the conversation. I might be completely wrong, but this is how I am perceiving it.
You are wrong and that was fucked up. I don’t just tell people “something is wrong with your brain/emotional regulation” a few sentences into a conversation. That was a shitty thing to do and I don’t care what your “perception” was. You need to really step back and recognize how wrong you were to do that.
I’m out dude. I wasn’t mad before but I sure am now.
Look, I already apologized and I mean it. I will just ask you now to reread the thread. You are stating that any independent service provider is as morally bankrupt as a large corporation like Meta. Don't you think that is also not at all insensitive and offensive?