this post was submitted on 24 Feb 2022
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They're attacking the airport right now with paratroopers.
Really? Again, let's see where you are getting this from.
It's hard to do a lot worse than literally being wrong about an invasion every step of the way in real time.
That's why @[email protected] had to dip out of this thread without providing a single piece of evidence for what they're saying
Because they didn't respond to dozens of comments from you on a minute by minute basis? Get a grip. Nobody owes you that.
If they didn't have evidence that I was wrong, they shouldn't have engaged with me in the first place
Edit: Hastily saying things like there are boots on the ground in Kiev without evidence is dangerous, warmongering talk. I won't allow it.
Again, you're delusional if you think anybody owes you minute by minute responses to everything you say. Go for a walk outside.
Minute by minute? It's been over an hour and I'm still waiting for evidence of boots on the ground in Kiev. And if you look at livestreams of Kiev it looks like a normal day, people going about their business.
Honestly, launching rockets is an attack on nation's sovereignty and is enough to be deemed an invasion. However, if you need evidence of ground forces:
https://mobile.twitter.com/Osinttechnical/status/1496732008881479681
https://mobile.twitter.com/KofmanMichael/status/1496752218296496128
https://mobile.twitter.com/franakviacorka/status/1496751495928295428
https://www.pravda.com.ua/news/2022/02/24/7325285/
https://twitter.com/AricToler/status/1496650245723521024
Ok, I don't know if you can read well, but, that's not Kiev. I think the assertion that Russian troops are in Kiev is ridiculous, and that's the evidence I demanded.
But no, until further verification, I'm staying undecided. I've seen too much misinformation tonight debunked by more sober and patient minds. A lot of the videos floating around on twitter are from 2014 or from other events. Or they mischaracterize the content. A boots on the ground invasion would be disastrous for Russia. And since Putin claimed Russia will not occupy Ukraine, it's incredibly unlikely. Does Putin really think he can occupy Ukraine and convince the world he hasn't done this? If they actually invaded all of Ukraine, it would be pointless to deny it officially.
Rest assured, that is not what is happening tonight. Everyone needs to calm down, wait for the dust to clear and real investigation to be done, and we will know the truth. Stop spreading lies about troops in Kiev, or Russia attacking Moldova, or other crazy bullshit.
With the benefit of some time, here's a more complete article on what happened. Turns out the source I heard it from originally (Marco Rubio) was quite correct. From this article, it sounds like there likely are at least some Russian troops on the outskirts of Kiev.
Marco Rubio? The republican senator? Are you fucking kidding me?
What it looks like from the article is that helicopters came in to destroy military infrastructure and left. We already knew this. I don't see anything like a permanent occupying force or ground invasion in Kiev
He sits on the Senate Intelligence Committee. I don't have a lot of faith in him, which is why I was fairly quick to withdraw the claim when I couldn't corroborate it. This article does corroborate his claim, though. From the article, quoting a local civilian referring to the base and surrounding areas:
Did I say Kiev? I am mostly responding with sources with boots in the ground.
I said Kiev. In the very post you're responding to!
It's a general thread regarding an invasion of Ukraine and honestly dude... if you want it to be that specific to help you feel better calling the invasion fake news, seek help. You really need it
But you are not responding to a general thread are you? You are responding to a specific comment in a specific thread of discussion.
“Russia is not ~~massing troops~~ ~~bombing~~ ~~invading~~ specifically invading Kiev in particular."
In order to prove what? That Ukraine hasn't been invaded by Russia? That the invasion doesn't extent into the capital? You sure seem smug about something... but it seems like you're nit picking in order suck up bandwidth from the truth of the matter.
At the time I posted this two days ago, there was no invasion into Ukraine. Russia pulled a pearl harbor style attack to disable the Ukrainian military. There was also some operations to make sure Ukraine couldn't shut off water to Crimea and to make sure Chernobyl wouldn't be damaged and releasing radiation it seems. This was not enough for Zelensky to cave, so they went further and are doing an operation in Kiev. They did not reach Kiev until late last night.
But when there were still only airstrikes in Ukraine, some online went straight with the conclusion that Russia was full-scale invading when that was not true, and it wasn't obvious that anything more than surgical strikes would happen.
It's very important to get the facts on this right when emotions are running so high. False claims of war crimes could trigger NATO intervention and WW3. I object to anyone confidently stating that either side is doing something within only a couple hours of scant reports being released. I default to agnosis. Both sides have motivations to make false reports of what's happening. So I 100% stand by what I said because it was true at the time.
Did you know that the Japanese were emboldened to first-strike Pearl Harbor by their success in crippling the Russian navy in the Russo-Japanese War? That's an all-out surprise attack to disable a stronger opponent. You're claiming more of a limited-violence sortie for humanitarian reasons. Isn't that exactly what you accuse NATO of?
I only make the comparison because the point of Pearl Harbor was to demilitarize the US by destroying our navy without invading the US mainland. That's where the comparison ends. If you believe the US and Ukrainian governments, this was not a surprise attack. They have been saying they knew this was coming for months.
The evidence that Russian troops had been massing at the Ukrainian border was overwhelming. Putin himself confirmed that there were troops, otherwise he couldn't confirm that one unit was being withdrawn. So, yeah, the US and Ukrainian governments are quite believable in that regard.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60503037
Still an evolving situation, but this is clearly a boots on the ground invasion, no two ways about it. I think it's a stretch to say that Putin wants to hold Ukraine himself for any length of time. That would be difficult and Russia simply doesn't have the ability to hold hostile territory that long.
BBC 💀
Again, nobody owes you minute by minute explanations. And yes, you were demanding those. About 20 minutes had passed from your last reply to the parent commenter to your next comment declaring that they ducked out of the thread, as if failing in a duty to respond to you.
Now you're constantly refreshing the page minute by minute, hour by hour, demanding that your confidently incorrect denials of obvious facts be responded to in detail.
That's ridiculous and it's wasting everybody's time.
My deepest apologies. It was nearing midnight and I needed to go to sleep instead of writing the requested essay.
If I accused you of murder or sexual assault, you would full well expect me to provide some proof before making that kind of situation. In a time when world tensions were high, you jumped to conclusions and made them higher by exaggerating what happened. I don't care if you don't want to write an essay, that's fine. But you chose to engage in these false claims in the first place, then dipped.
Remember when Russian backed separatists shot down that airliner? Their defense was also "prove it", "show me the evidence", "the plane shot down itself". Years later, we can see that this is simply a ploy to distract, distort and delay. These disingenuous tactics have become all too transparent.