this post was submitted on 04 Mar 2025

286 points (99.7% liked)

Games

18100 readers

412 users here now

Video game news oriented community. No NanoUFO is not a bot :)

Posts.

News oriented content (general reviews, previews or retrospectives allowed).
Broad discussion posts (preferably not only about a specific game).
No humor/memes etc..
No affiliate links
No advertising.
No clickbait, editorialized, sensational titles. State the game in question in the title. No all caps.
No self promotion.
No duplicate posts, newer post will be deleted unless there is more discussion in one of the posts.
No politics.

Comments.

No personal attacks.
Obey instance rules.
No low effort comments(one or two words, emoji etc..)
Please use spoiler tags for spoilers.

My goal is just to have a community where people can go and see what new game news is out for the day and comment on it.

Other communities:

Beehaw.org gaming

Lemmy.ml gaming

lemmy.ca pcgaming

founded 2 years ago

MODERATORS

[email protected]

286

Square Enix has removed Denuvo from Final Fantasy 16 (www.dsogaming.com)

submitted 1 week ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

31 comments fedilink hide all child comments

all 32 comments

sorted by: hot top controversial new old

[–] [email protected] 100 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Time for another before/after performance comparison, just for an ignorant Denuvo salestwat to say: "Nuh-Uh"

[+] [email protected] -52 points 1 week ago (6 children)

Denuvo itself, if correctly implemented, has minimal impact. The thing is most games call it too often or wrongly implements it, which slow things down considerably.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 6 days ago (1 children)

Yes, I think you’re right. Games perform better when they call Denuvo less frequently. Therefore, for optimal performance, games should call Denuvo 0 times.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 5 days ago

For sure 😂

[–] [email protected] 77 points 1 week ago (2 children)

That may be the case, but doesn't change the fact, that games run better without Denuvo.

It also doesn't change the fact that the activation limit is stupid as hell when you are using Linux and every Proton change counts as a new activation.

As far as I know Denuvo also hinders the development of native Linux builds of games.

And if you see video games as art, Denuvo actively stands in the way of preservation.

Obviously it is anti-consumer as you can't do backups, need constant internet convection, if any part of the chain breaks you are screwed out of your game, it hinders mod developers and so on.

[–] [email protected] 28 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

Its only positive, is that the denuvo license is non-perpetual.

This is what has led to the trend of it getting removed after a while, because if the publisher wants to keep using it, they have to keep paying.

They aren't removing it because people hate it, they're removing it because once launch year has passed, and the crack is out, there's little reason for the publisher to keep paying denuvo to apply drm.

Much better than it being on there forever on every game that ever launched with it.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 week ago

Yea, they often want to secure the first month-year of sales as it's most of the sales anyway. Sometimes there's some user pressure but that's really rare.

[–] [email protected] 9 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

I don't need to be convinced. I'm all for DRM-free games and have been using GOG for quite some time.

Fuck Denuvo, all my homies hate DRMs; but still, let's not misinform because of our opinions, that would be falling low.

I'll be switching to Linux soon, and didn't know about the activation stuff. That's going to suck. I'm nearly always staying away from AAA games & games that implement Denuvo, but still, good to know! Thanks

[–] [email protected] 36 points 1 week ago (1 children)

Okay, but if lots of games are doing it wrong, it's still Denuvo's fault.

[+] [email protected] -23 points 1 week ago (1 children)

It's the developers' fault, but it's caused by Denuvo, if that's what you meant.

[–] [email protected] 26 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (2 children)

No, I mean that if lots of developers are using Denuvo wrong, it's Denuvo's fault for being too difficult to use correctly or not providing enough support to developers.

Even if it's the developers using it wrong, if lots of developers are doing that then it's a fault with Denuvo.

If one car hits something, it's a problem with that car. If lots of cars keep hitting something, it's a problem with the road.

[–] [email protected] -4 points 1 week ago (2 children)

Somehow the same logic is not applied when people talk about Linux. It's always the developers fault if something doesn't work on it, such as multiplayer games, standard engineering softwares, or even computer accessories.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

It's always the developers fault if something doesn’t work on it, such as multiplayer games

But it is. There's nothing Linux devs can do if game/anticheat devs block Linux.

For the rest, Linux does a phenomenal job building compatibility for Windows applications to the point where it's better than Windows for a lot of old software. But there's only so far you can go emulating a thing.

Likewise for accessories, it's not Linux's fault hardware manufacturers don't support Linux and don't provide the documentation for Linux devs to properly support it either.

Blaming Linux for any of this is like blaming blind people for not reading a sign.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 week ago

Because those developers are not actually trying to get it to work in Linux, they are trying to get it to work in Windows.

Game developers that are licensing denuvo probably are trying to get their game with denuvo.

Linux intended software does not have the performance issues denuvo has.

[–] [email protected] -5 points 1 week ago

Could be the case I guess. I'd still blame the developers, I would imagine Denuvo has some type of support & docs to help prevent these issues, as in the end it hurts their business.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 1 week ago (1 children)

So you admit games simply run better without it.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 week ago

Yes, but not by much if applied correctly

[–] [email protected] 5 points 1 week ago (1 children)

If very many developers integrating Denuvo are making errors with it, it's because of Denuvo. Their documentation is insufficient or their interface is poorly designed or something. Or maybe their code really is just shit. Most likely some combination of factors. Regardless, I'm not letting them off the hook; this is still their fault as much as it is that of the companies choosing to use it.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

They’re just providing a service. We should mostly blame the editors/devs that are making the choice of including it.

I hate the tool but idc about the company

As for the implementation problem, I feel like at this point it’s like the more their functions are called, the harder the game becomes to decode/crack, so it often slow things down because devs overcall it

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 week ago

Just to be clear, I wasn't making a moral argument in my previous comment, only a technical one. If their software causes slowdowns in many real-world cases, I blame them for it, not just the people who are using it.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 week ago (1 children)

"It's not that it adds overhead on top, it's just that it adds to the top some head over.

[–] [email protected] -3 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

You must not get my point. What I’m saying is that if Denuvo is implemented properly, we shouldn’t see a difference that’s more than like 3%. If it’s more, then it’s called too often and thus a bad implementation from the devs.

When comparison videos are shared, it’s often on games with bad implementations. You can also find some comparisons that don’t affect performance as much. In the end it’s the Denuvo implementation that’s slowing down, and that’s on the dev, not the company making unoptimized code.

I’m not denying that it impacts performance: it does, but not as much as you might believe if properly implemented, which if not, is not Denuvo's (the company) fault, but rather the devs'.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 1 week ago (1 children)

I get you, but I think at a certain point if we're relying on it being properly implemented and a large group isn't then I'd say we're back on denuvo as the party at fault for not addressing it and preventing it.

It sucks, but we have to expect and plan for when people are stupid to a point because that is always going to be a key source of failure.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

That’s an opinion :) alright then

[–] [email protected] 22 points 1 week ago (2 children)

I'm sure part of it is to stop paying Denuvo the $20,000+ a month fee to keep it active, but regardless I'm glad they're doing the right thing.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 week ago

So, they are losing more money on Denuvo than they would lose on piracy.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 1 week ago (1 children)

A win for preservation. I really wish ubisoft and capcom would start doing this for their older games too.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago) (1 children)

I believe Ubisoft also have their own DRM on top but it can be bypassed. Still, annoying stuff.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 1 week ago

Yeah its pretty bad that ubisoft games have 3 layers of drm - steam, ubi launcher, denuvo.

It seams like EA is learning and releasing some steam games without the ea launcher, i hope Ubi is next too.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 1 week ago

Good riddance. Might be willing to check the game out now.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 1 week ago

Yay? I wish they'd made the game more interesting, but I guess that's nice.