If you like debian and just need a newer kernel you could just add backports to your debian install then install the kernel during the install process.
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Debian stable + XFCE for me. Missing newer packages though. I'm interested in what problems you had with Fedora
I had problems with waking from sleep/hibernate, audio issues (total dropouts as well as distortion in screen-recording apps), choppy video playback and refusal to enter fullscreen, wonky cursor scaling, apps not working as expected or not running at all. I've managed to fix most of these or find temporary workarounds (grateful for flatpaks for once!) or alternative applications. But the experience was not fun, particularly as there was only a 2 week return window for the laptop and I needed to be sure the problems weren't hardware design/choice related. And I'm finding it 50/50 whether an app actually works when I install it from the repo. There's a lot less documentation for manually installing things as well and DNF is slow compared to apt...
I don't want to say for certain that Fedora as a distro is to blame but I suspect that it is. I miss my Debian days.
(grateful for flatpaks for once!)
That's how I run my system right now. Fedora KDE + pretty much everything as Flatpak.
Gives me a recent enough kernel and KDE version so I don't have to worry when I get new hardware or new features drop but also restricts major updates to new Fedora versions so I can hold those back for a few weeks.
I made a similar switch as you but from Ubuntu to Fedora because of outdated firmware and kernel.
Ubuntu. It's boring but it all works.
Ubuntu is literally just Debian unstable with a bunch of patches. Literally every time I've been forced to use it, it's been broken in at least a few obvious places.
So, you are saying Debian is the better choice, right?
Ubuntu comes with non-free drivers which can make it easier to set up and use. I use Debian on my server and Ubuntu on my laptops. They have both been pretty reliable for me. LTS versions of Ubuntu are pretty bug free but have older versions of software. I'd guess that Daniel was using a non-LTS release which are a bit more bleeding edge. The LTS ones strike a good balance between modernity and stability.
Absolutely. I've been running Debian for literally decades both personally & professionally (on servers) and it's rock-solid.
On the desktop, it's also very stable, but holy-fuck is it old. I'm happy to accept the occasionally bug in exchange for modern software though, so I use Arch (btw) on the desktop.
I am currently using an recent version of Ubuntu live USB for backups and a "serious" error window pops up every time I boot it. Same experience with Ubuntu installations. For me at least, Ubuntu isn't anything close to stable.
The thing with Debian is that yes, it's the most stable distro family, but stable != "just works", especially when talking about a PC and not a server (as a PC is more likely to need additional hardware drivers). Furthermore, when the time comes that you DO want to upgrade Debian to a newer version, it's one of the more painful distros to do so.
I think fedora is a good compromise there. It's unstable compared to RHEL, but it's generally well-vetted and won't cause a serious headache once every few years like Debian.
What makes Debian 12 a painful distro to upgrade?
I don't understand that comment either. I've been using Debian for years on my server, and it just keeps up with the times (well with Debian times, not necessarily current times).
It's way easier than Kubuntu was for me, for example, which required reinstalling practically every time I wanted to upgrade. A few times the upgrade actually worked, but most of the time I had to reinstall.
Debian as a server is fine and probably the best ! However as a daily drive OS I don't think it's the best choice.
I have always seen Debian as server distro and that's probably what they meant ?
I have debian as my server distro since the beginning of my Linux journey (NEVER failed me !) However I can't see how Debian as daily drive is a good idea. Sure they try to catch up with testing repo for those who wan't a more up to date distro, but it's seems harder to keep up when something breaks along the way.
That's where Arch and derivatives shine, if something goes wrong it's fixed in a few days.
I've been daily driving it on my desktop and laptop for several months now, seems fine. But I don't need the bleeding edge either.
But that's not what the comment was about... The top level comment said Debian was hard to upgrade, and I have not had that experience.
I am a longtime fan of Debian Stable, for exactly that reason. I installed the XFCE version using the custom installer about 8 years ago and have had very few issues.
Initially my GPU wasn't well supported so I had to use the installer from Nvidia, forcing me to manually reinstall the driver after every kernel update. That issue has been fixed in recent years so now I can just use the driver from the Debian repos.
I installed the unattended-updates package about 2 years ago and it has been smooth sailing since
My desktop has been running debian for 5 years no problem including 2 major debian version upgrades, and a new(er) GPU.
I had an old laptop that ran the same debian install for 8 years. All upgrades in place, no reinstalls.
boring, and works. Stable + backports should cover the majority of people with new hardware support needs.
The fact that you're even saying such things as "time constraints" or "to learn new software" suggests an attitude to computing shared by about 0.01% of the population. It cannot be re-stressed enough to the (sadly shrinking) bubble that frequents this community: the vast majority of people in the world have never touched a laptop let alone a desktop computer. Literally everything now happens on mobile, where FOSS is vanishingly insignificant, and soon AI is going to add a whole new layer of dystopia. But that is slightly offtopic.
It's a good question IMO. Choosing software freedom - to the small extent that you still can - should not just be about the freedom to tinker, it should also just be easy.
The answer is Ubuntu or Mint or Fedora.
You simply don't do any maintenance whatsoever.
t. Got a arch linux install that I (rarely) perform "sudo pacman -Syu --noconfirm" and it works like a champ.
I used to lose my keys all the time. I don't want to spend so much time looking for my keys, nowadays I mostly just leave them in the front door, I rarely lock it and it works like a champ.
Same with fedora. Just run the upgrade once in a while and it work.
PopOS is very stable as a desktop. It also keeps up to date with packages better than base Ubuntu in my opinion.
As others have mentioned, Debian stable and Xubuntu are my default recommendations for anyone who wants a simple "just works" kind of system. Debian if they want it to be as clean as possible, Xubuntu if they want some creature comfort right out of the box.
Idem, I default to debian on server and Xubuntu on laptop.
You're not going to believe this, but I've found Arch is it. My desktop install was in December 2018: Sway with Gnome apps. Save for Gnome rolling dice on every major update, it's been perfectly boring and dependable.
There are two camps of Arch users:
- Use it despite it breaking on every update, because of AUR and other benefits
- What? Arch breaks?
Use timeshift, It saved my ass like 3 times
I've been running Manjaro for the last 4 months and it's been incredibly reliable and smooth. I haven't done any serious tweaking beyond installing a realtime audio kernal. I run updates every few days and I haven't had a single issue so far.
Edit: what's up with the down voting? If there's something incorrect with recommending Manjaro in this context, I'd love to know why, since I'm still relatively new to Linux.
I've posted something similar a couple of days ago after my Endeavour OS took a dump to no return and I needed a reinstall. I, too, want a system where I set it and forget it. I've researched so much and now I have two things I'm experimenting with. I'm currently running Nobara OS (because I play games here and there) as an experiment to see how long it lasts without breaking. I have backed up everything.
Its users swore up and down that it never breaks if you're not a "tinkerer". Even its creator said that the distro isn't for those who like to tinker. His goal was to have a distro that is as stable as an immutable, but not immutable itself.
So far, I like how it tries so hard to keep you away from the terminal. There is a GUI app for everything. Even their updating process is different than Fedora (which is what it's based on). The developers are even planning on making something for upgrading between major releases that is a press of a button like they do with their updates through an app. So far so good.
My next experiment after this (if it fails) will be to run an immutable distro. Most likely Bazzite. They're not my cup of tea, but I'll sacrifice that for my sanity and for the sake of getting shit done.
For as much hate as it gets Ubuntu (or kubuntu for the kde version) will feel very familiar in usage and will have a newer kernel. It’s my default it just needs to work distro if regular Debian isn’t an issue due to drivers or something similar.
Eeh, idk. I've first installed kubuntu 20.04, then used it all the way up to 24.04, updating each version. I tinkered with it, added ppas, ect. and each update new random issues started piling up. I switched to fedora when the update to 24.04 completely broke my system, I don't recommend kubuntu.