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I think it's because owners and gm's saw these guys on belicheck's crew and thought well, they must be good look how much the patriots were winning.
The assistants move on to head coaching positions and then realize they were ok as an assistant couch but had nowhere the head to be at the top..
"Imperect Fruit" is a strange way of saying "Failure"
Because of Tom Brady. Tom Brady was always the cog that kept the machine running.
Without him? Well, we've seen the results.
Gonna go on a limb and say Tom Brady might’ve been a factor lol
Tom Brady is WAAAAAY better than most people even think he is. He elevated everything, made other things look good, made up for mistakes etc.
Because they cheated to win multiple super bowls on top of having one of the best QBs ever...
Because they embody the worst traits of Bill (hubris, alienating certain players, treating them like chess pieces), without any of the positives (some really great gameplans, and actually having decent interpersonal skills), and without also having the best QB ever (who also had GOAT level leadership and intangibles) to cover it up any flaws and get the team to buy in.
And even then, Bill has started to look like his assistants without Tom as well.
I'm not saying Belichick is horrible coach or anything but it really shows you how important having the right QB is.
I think Tom Brady was the brains of the org
A Poison Tree
I was angry with my friend;
I told my wrath, my wrath did end.
I was angry with my foe:
I told it not, my wrath did grow.
And I waterd it in fears,
Night & morning with my tears:
And I sunned it with smiles,
And with soft deceitful wiles.
And it grew both day and night.
Till it bore an apple bright.
And my foe beheld it shine,
And he knew that it was mine.
And into my garden stole,
When the night had veild the pole;
In the morning glad I see;
My foe outstretched beneath the tree.
-William Blake
Because other teams don’t have the best qb of all time
BOB and Brian Flores had pretty good tenures and are overall great coaches
BoB and Flores were good head coaches, this has always been an overrated dialogue
The BB style is alienating. It requires a certain level of football genius to get away with.
Given the last three years, is this even a serious question?
Because he's not a good head coach. He's well under .500 when he doesn't have the greatest player in the history of football playing the game's most important position. A sub .500 coach probably isn't going to produce more great coaches.
Belichick is an all-time great defensive coordinator, but it's extremely evident that Tom Brady carried his offense for 20 years. That's why Weis, McDaniels, Patricia, O'Brien, etc. all sucked when they moved on. And all the defensive assistants that moved on suck too, because they no longer had Belichick himself.
imperfect fruit
That’s an interesting way to spell rotten
Reality is most coaches fail.
In Belichick tree it seems the coaches are often arrogant. Not sure they realize the Patriots way culture was a unique special circumstance that can’t be reproduced.
Dominique Foxworths podcast did a good job talking about it. You need a low round QB who starts a game manager. An underdog team that wins big which gels them together. Then that QB needs to become best ever while keeping the team attitude going.
The assistant coaches all seem to think they are the system and not that they are a product of the system.
I have a theory...
Because there's a difference between being a good head coach and being able to TEACH someone to be a good head coach.
In the late 90s/early 2000s, when he medically retired from WWF/WWE, Shawn Michaels opened a wrestling school. One of the biggest criticisms of him as a teacher (most famously from Bryan Danielson) was that while he was undoubtedly one of the best wrestlers of his era (and possibly of all time), he had a real problem teaching others to do what came naturally to him.
It's possible that Belichick is the same way.
Because they didn’t have Tom Brady
They still cheat. No Tom Brady. Doesn’t bode well when you don’t have the aforementioned on your new team
Because you can’t always fall ass- backwards into having Tom Brady.
Belichick failed in Cleaveland, succeeded in NE with Brady, and is failing with not-Brady.
This isn’t difficult.
Are you stupid? Do you even think for a second before spouting nonsense like this?
Brady’s first 3 rings were because of the defense. He was a game manager.
In the losses to the Giants Belichick’s defense allowed under 20 points and Brady could only score 14.
Against the Seahawks Brady was incredible yet Belichick’s defense won the game with the Malcolm Butler INT.
Against the Falcons Belichick’s defense allowed 0 points in the second half which is the only reason Brady’s comeback was possible.
I’ll give you the 2017 Eagles Super Bowl, Brady carried them in that game and Bill’s defense was terrible. Got cooked by Nick Foles.
And finally, the 2019 Rams Super Bowl where Belichick’s defense allowed 3 points against the best offense in the league so Brady won a ring while scoring only 13 points…
I’m not trying to discredit anyone here like you. Both Brady and Belichick had a major part in their success. It was a team effort between them.
Belichick failed in Cleaveland
He absolutely did not fail in Cleveland. He spent 92 and 93 rebuilding a team that had bottomed out, won a playoff game in 94, and was very much in the playoff hunt at 4-4 going into the weekend that Modell announced he was moving the team to Baltimore. They went 1-6 after that announcement.
Because it’s becoming increasingly obvious that BB is pretty overrated and was clearly carried by an all time great QB.
By no mean do I actually know, but my head cannon has always been he dosent actually let these guys call shots lol.
I mean look at the people who have recently came from the patriots. They aren’t just bad coaches they are utterly incompetent.
In all seriousness you could put a HS coach in McDaniel s shoes an he would coach the raiders to more wins atp in the season.
An so no one will ever change my mind, Bill hires these guys because they’re not good. In his mind he dosent really need them, why bring in someone who’s gonna voice an opinion against yours when you can bring in Duds like Patricia an McDaniels an have 100% control over your team.
It helps cause if something goes wrong, it’s why would Patricia do that. But when it goes right Belicheck is their for the praise.
But that’s just my opinion.
"Imperfect Fruit" is a nice description for dog shit.
Being an nfl coach is hard as fuck. Just look at Andy Reid who had an incredible tree just a few years ago. Most of his “fruit” has turned rotten. Nagy and shurmur are absolutely trash. Rivera and Pederson were once high flyers, now they are the epitome of mediocre. Frank Reich flamed out. McDermott is still doing well but another year or two of playoff chokes and the bills probably move on. Harbaugh is the diamond obviously, but how much of that is also attributed to being around football his whole life? Clearly being a great coach runs in the family.
Some of the pats guys have been horrible coaches, but some have also been solid. I think if bob had been in more stable front office setting and florez had another year of experience both would have had way more success. Florez clearly had very limited connections across the league and hired way too many pats guys on the offense. He needed a better staff and that was probably his downfall. I think any patriots “coordinator” should probably leave and take a true coordinator job with someone else for a year or two before they make the jump to head coach.
Because he’s not in the business of trying to make his coaches Head Coaches elsewhere. He’s trying to win football games. You can argue that part of that is trying to help his coaches improve. But he has coaches in certain roles and only wants them filling that role. Plus the guys that left to be HCs elsewhere all try to be him instead of themselves. Instead of taking bits and pieces of what they learn from him and including it into how they run their teams, they’re trying to do exactly what he does. And it doesn’t work because they aren’t him. They haven’t garnered the respect because they didn’t have his accomplishments. It works for him because he achieved so much in his career. They try to be carbon copies of him without the accomplishments. I’m hoping Mayo sees that and tries to do things his own way while incorporating some of the things he learned from BB instead of just doing things the way BB does. I think he’s smart enough to know that but we’ll see.
Because brady covered for all of them.
It’s because the Tree himself (BB) is “imperfect”
And y’all pats fans don’t wanna come to grips with that.
Fruit of the poisoned tree
Unfortunately for them the tb12 genetic marker, is recessive
Let me fix this....
Why didn't anyone but Bill have Tom Brady?
You're welcome.
Because they didn't get to continue to be carried by the greatest QB of all time.
I still believe Mangini could have been something if he hadn't gone to the Browns to die.
Cause even belichick is trash without Brady or gronk
“It was Brady the whole time?”
“Always was.”
👨🚀🔫
No Tom Brady
Because he’s an overrated coach…
Brian Flores is a dawg, keep his name out yo mouth, basically got fired from taking a team everyone knows they tried to tank and won plenty of games
Bill is a fraud that benefited from tom brady
Tampa needs a head coach
Threads like these remind me to never take anything y’all say seriously lmao apparently belichick just lucked himself into 20 years of unprecedented dominance and he’s actually not good at all
Their strong suit is cheating.
Bill is a football nerd who is good with his guys and had the GOAT. His branches also seem to be football nerds but they don't have the GOAT and they seemingly suck at being good locker room guys.
Because everyone ignores his greatest success, Nick Saban
Bill was never a good coach but a good cheater. That doesn’t produce a good coaching tree.
When the root of the tree looks suspect itself without the GOAT at QB, it only makes sense that the branches of the tree are mostly frauds. Patricia and McDaniels in particular were just assholes who didn’t know how to work with others.