doctordevice

Obama was cheated, but he caught the DNC off guard. They learned their lesson from that and prepared more for Hillary's coronation that Obama disrupted.

Obama was also an insider, so they didn't fight back quite as hard. But they used a lot of the same dirty tricks, stoking racism against him and accusing the opposition of sexism.

You're arguing on a very narrow definition of "cheated." If you agree that the Democratic primaries were not democratic, then it's just a matter of semantics. The DNC had rules on their charter to conduct primaries impartially. They did not abide by those rules, and flat out said they didn't have to. That's conducting a supposedly impartial primary fraudulently in order to give advantage to their preferred candidate. It's not criminal fraud, but it is the definition of rigging. They did do it to Obama and he overcame it, they did it to Bernie learning from their mistakes and Bernie couldn't overcome it.

Justice sensitivity is a good motivator for resisting fascism. Also for causing arguments at family board games nights.

I think you'll find that was after you baselessly attacked me.

None of that justifies the extreme response you had to a criticism of Democrats. One that I feel is quite valid and from your responses it kinda feels like you don't disagree.

All I'm saying is don't be so prejudiced against people who criticize the Democrats. We're not all that minority you're talking about.

And to paraphrase you: a year long fight? Those are rookie numbers. You gotta pump those numbers up. It's been 8+ years of centrists accusing progressives of being responsible for everything wrong with the Democrats and Republicans. With things exactly like your comment that kicked this whole thing off. So I'm sorry if this past year has been hard with the asshats from ml, I would urge you not to perpetuate that behavior yourself. Chances are you're doing it to someone who's been dealing with it a lot longer than a year.

IMO, you shouldn't be so quick to apply that particular extreme version of a lefty to everyone who criticizes the Democratic Party. That's a minority you're describing. Most lefties voted for Clinton, Biden, and Harris. Unless you want to dig into history to lobby the same criticism at Clinton supporters who voted for McCain. There's always people who don't make sense who do stuff like that. Plus many people who were Bernie supporters in 2016 were never really lefties to begin with. I'm not saying that as a "no true Scotsman" thing, just that Bernie attracted a wider range of people fed up with the establishment and some of them would not have self-identified as a leftist.

It's quite prejudiced to just blanket assume everyone to your left is this extreme version you've concocted. And before you say you don't do that, remember how aggressive you were to me when I gave you zero indication that I fell into your little lefty box.

Look, maybe it's the autism acting up again but I legitimately don't see it. Can you help me see where it turned to lefties before your comment? The OP is about Elon, a right wing figure, with the narcissist's prayer excusing his behavior. Very clearly a criticism of a specific right winger.

Then this comment:

"Trump won't even be that bad, you LIBERALS are just fearmongering!" God. It's going to be a long [insert period of time here]

I read that as a pseudoquote of a hypothetical right wing voter. Complete with the way they spew "LIBERAL." "Trump won't be that bad" isn't a common lefty position I've seen, most of us voted against our own conscience specifically to keep Trump out.

Then the dino comic that, arguably, could be considered a depiction of your hypothetical lefties. But with the context of the comment it replied to I interpreted it more as a Leopards Ate My Face depiction of Republican voters voting against their own interests.

Then you entered with what appeared to me to be a hard turn towards blaming the far left for what's happening on the right.

The things you were replying to were about Republican voters? You made it about Democratic voters.

You make some wild assumptions to argue against and it's exhausting. I think you should read back your replies to me and make note of all the times you just assume something and then throw it at me as an attack.

You conveniently left out the part where you threw the first stone at left-leaning voters who lobby criticism against the Democratic Party:

bUt ThE DeMoCraTz DidN't dO EnOugH fOr tHe WOrKinG cLaSs!!

I responded to that by pointing out that the thing you stated to mock people who hold that sentiment is actually true. (But now you've pivoted and actually think it is true? I can't figure your stance out at all.) You didn't say anything about nonvoters, no one before you said anything about nonvoters, I was the one who pointed out that nonvoters were a problem by claiming the Democrats foster voter apathy. Does that seem like something a nonvoter would say? But you proceeded to launch an attack against me regardless. And when I pushed backed you kept attacking based on assumptions.

For example: You started throwing out insults about my participation in the political process based on, again, assumptions.

Well, you weren't entirely wrong but you are pretty ableist. You're right that I don't go to meetings. I'm autistic and cannot contribute very well socially. Turning it on for work drains me to the point where I can't muster anything else for being around people. I can't understand speech very easily in noisy environments, and even when I can understand I don't interpret the same way as other people. So instead I research candidates locally and nationally and support in other ways, mainly by donating to progressive primary campaigns. My representative is a pretty safe progressive seat so I don't usually donate to them, but I do donate to progressives for other local and state offices, I donated to Bernie in 2016 and 2020, and I'll usually look for other key progressive campaigns in other states to support.

And we do disagree on one thing: I perceived the 2020 primary as a planned, concerted effort by the party to flood the field in order to drown out the fringes, and then drop and push everything towards Biden leading up to Super Tuesday. That's not even getting into suspicions of both parties using media outlets to push propaganda. I'm still waiting for a primary where the DNC operates in a way to actually let the public form opinions rather than engineering it to push their preferred candidate. As far as I can tell the last time that happened was Obama in 2008 and the party has worked hard ever since to make the primary a farce.

Lol, you wanna square this "oh I'm on the same side as you" with your immediate attack on me based on nothing but your assumption? Because I can't figure out what in my original response you disagree with if what you say here is true. You just immediately went full neoliberal attack on any criticism of the Democrats, so frankly I don't buy your bullshit here.

8 years is how long the Democrats have been openly and unashamedly thumbing the scale in their primaries (starting in 2016) and the start of the progressive movement, it's not a competition.

I'm neurodivergent and messages are significantly more accessible to me, especially in a work context.

I struggle to take in audio information, so if it's important then messages are much better because I can refer back to them. If it's not important, it's not worth the interruption because messages also don't take me out of my workflow because it's asynchronous so I can read and respond when I've got a moment. A 5 minute unscheduled call is significantly more disruptive to me than an hour long scheduled meeting.

No matter how many times I tell my boss all of this, I get at least one unscheduled no context "do you have a minute to chat?" every single day and it's effect on my productivity is very problematic.

Excuse me? I've voted for 3 people in a row that I didn't believe deserved to be the nominee, let alone president. Every time I voted against them in the primaries because I didn't believe they stood a good chance in the general, nor would they be good for the country while in office. For Kamala, I didn't even get the opportunity to vote against her in the primary but I did vote for uncommitted delegates over Joe Biden. Every time, I voted for them in the general even though that vote was coerced through a corrupt system that refuses to let me vote for someone who actually represents me.

8 goddamn years of listening to high and mighty people like you telling me how everything that's happening is my fault even though I voted against what was happening at every turn. Fuck off.

I mean... they didn't though. That's why they struggle to win in the general even though their platform as stated is good for the populace. When they don't actually follow through on that, people have a hard time believing them even though they're clearly the lesser of two evils.

The Democrats foster their own worst enemy: voter apathy. And it doesn't help that they also foster extremism in the opposition party and then turn around and try to extort the American public with it.