growsomethinggood

OP is literally a Trump supporter

I think there are metaphors that are helpful to trans people and there are metaphors that are helpful to explaining transness to cis people. The left-handed metaphor is definitely in the "for cis people" category imo.

I think more folks need to understand that "hey I didn't like that joke" or "hey I know you didn't mean it that way but that hurt me" as inherently being shamed by someone, or even shameful at all. People are messy! We're going to step on each other's toes even when we're doing our best. I think OP did an absolutely perfect job of saying, oh, you're correct, that wasn't my intention, let me make sure that's clear to everyone right away. And then no one has to make any fuss about it from there. At the end of the day, your feelings about being gently corrected are yours to deal with, not the responsibility of the person or people correcting you.

And to be clear, I know this is difficult! It's emotional labor you have to do. If you want to reframe your feeling of shame as something else (I like gratitude personally, like my friend has told me I have something in my teeth and I should fix that before I talk more), that can be useful.

Ultimately, trans people and other minorities don't owe you gentleness when they're hurt. It helps to be nice and low expectations like I have tried to be here, but that is a privileged position. It isn't easy to hear someone lash out at you in pain and say "thank you for sharing this with me, I will reflect on it" but I'm telling you, it is worth it. Listening to other people is so important to protect minorities in any majority-ruled democracy.

And like I said, no one has to do this. But this is the process by which you can take casual allies of circumstance and make them trusted friends. And I think we all need more trusted friends nowadays.

I don't put much stock in post votes, but I don't think a majority popular comment that the person I was replying to already agreed with is, uh, getting blowback. Honestly you seem to be the most hostile one here. If you'd read any of the lovely conversations I've already had with folks here, you'd understand that I haven't blamed anyone for this joke, I am simply communicating what I have heard in the community, and I don't have any expectations of changes in behavior as a result of this.

It's not bigotry to call out jokes on the internet, btw. For someone fighting a war on behalf of us all I'd figure this would be lower priority!

I'm going to stop responding to you since you don't seem to be engaging with the intention to actually listen to minorities, ciao!

Why are trans people's feelings less important than feelings of people making jokes online?

I don't want to be arguing here either, that's why I'm politely letting folks know that these sort of jokes may alienate their allies. You don't have to do anything with that information if you don't want to! Don't engage with this at all, and feel free to let me know what material good you've done to fight for trans rights in the time saved, will you?

I think you're continuing to misinterpret me here, I clarified above that I'm not speaking about you directly, but the general "you". Here it is again edited for clarity:

And, like I've been saying, I'm just here to inform. No one has to engage with this if they don't want to. If one interprets it as chilling, then I think that's a relationship with the joke and the context that one would need to work through individually. It's okay to have a joke fall flat! Or have certain groups not find it very funny. If one stops telling any jokes because one is worried about polite criticism, I don't think one really is interested in making people laugh, you know?

I'm not here to judge the response of the trans people in that post, that's their business as far as I'm concerned, just posting that it exists. (I happened to be aware of these folks talking about it so I figured it was easy to cite, I'm sure there are plenty of varied responses that are more diplomatic online)

I appreciate the tone as well, but I think it's something that's easier when you're more removed from the issue. As a cis woman, I have the luxury of not being as directly affected by this joke. You can see from my example that trans people talking to other trans people may be much more hurt and angry. If they were trying to explain this in a thread like this, would it be as easy to hold a civil tone? Would someone in your position have the same patience with someone expressing their pain more bluntly as you have with me? Just some things to think about.

My apologies on a few things that I think got misinterpreted there. I meant to type "can" not "can't" for "you can take that information" and I think that came off worse for the typo (which I've edited above). As well, I was referring to the general "you" in regards to repeating the joke, as in "one could keep repeating it if one liked", not you specifically (which I continue to use below).

For finding the joke funny because Elon wouldn't like it, the reason Elon wouldn't like it is because he's transphobic. It's not generally considered good allyship to misgender people for laughs, even if that person is bigoted. For a trans example, people misgender Caitlin Jenner because she has a bad political alignment, and trans people are obviously against that (her gender should still be respected even if she isn't, because misgendering her normalizes misgendering as punishment for trans people others disagree with, liberal or conservative). Similarly, misgendering cis people might do less harm than misgendering trans people, but it doesn't do zero harm either for the same normalization reasons.

And, like I've been saying, I'm just here to inform. No one has to engage with this if they don't want to. If you interpret it as chilling, then I think that's a relationship with the joke and the context that you would need to work through individually. It's okay to have a joke fall flat! Or have certain groups not find it very funny. If you stop telling any jokes because you're worried about polite criticism, I don't think you really are interested in making people laugh, you know?

Then simple question, why not use First Gentleman? Kamala Harris' husband was Second Gentleman and would have been first if she had won.

You're speaking with a lot of confidence about the validity of the feelings of a group of people who, I'm guessing, you are not apart of.

You asked women or trans people to say otherwise if they disagreed with you- I'm a woman, my friends are trans people, and there are two more trans people as well. Like I said, I can't poll everyone, but neither can you. You can choose to do with that information what you like, but there's literally no way to prove this definitively.

As for the screenshot, the order is middle-top-bottom reading order (which I agree is confusing) or smallest font to biggest font. The middle is an account using "Elonia" as a joke, the top is a trans woman who quotes it calling it out for transmisogyny, and the bottom is a trans man replying in agreement with the trans woman.