this post was submitted on 08 Jun 2022
2 points (66.7% liked)

Economics

1802 readers
4 users here now

founded 5 years ago
MODERATORS
[email protected]
2
Authoritarian leaders are turning to food export bans amid war in Ukraine (www.piie.com)
submitted 2 years ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]
23 comments fedilink hide all child comments
top 23 comments
sorted by: hot top controversial new old
[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (2 children)

Ukraine's export bans are understandable considering the havoc being wrought on domestic production and difficulties in securing bulk imports due to Russia's blockades of Ukraine's ports.

That's a really weird way to say Ukraine mined their ports preventing shipping. Russia literally offered to help clear the mines and establish a corridor for shipping grain last I checked.

Meanwhile, Russia hasn't banned exports of food either. What they said is that they want to be paid in roubles. Russia just had a summit with African nations to discuss food exports there.

It's also bizarre that the article fails to mention the primary cause for the food crisis, which is the fact that the west decided to ban import of fertilizer from Russia and Belarus. The actual exports of grain from Ukraine account for around 2.5% of the overall market.

This article appears to be full of misinformation.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (2 children)

That’s a really weird way to say Ukraine mined their ports preventing shipping. Russia literally offered to help clear the mines and establish a corridor for shipping grain last I checked.

I'm not saying I like naval mines (they're killing dolphins), but Russia would be steamrolling their ports right now if there weren't mines. The offers to help are mere propaganda points. Sure Russia would love to get rid of those pesky mines that make invasion more difficult. "For shipping" my ass. If Russia genuinely wants to help, they must include credible, irrevocable, unqualified guarantees that they will not attack via sea.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 2 years ago

Modern ships have ranges of tens or hundreds of kilometers. They wont be deterred by some mines in a harbor. And Russia certainly has no reason to do an amphibious landing when they can simply attack by land on many fronts.

In reality the mines are only a problem for civilian shipping.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 years ago (1 children)

The point here is that it's not Russia that's preventing the shipping from happening. Also, Russia is going to steam roll these coastal cities within months anyways. There is no scenario where Ukraine is going to keep its ports when this is all over.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (2 children)

So you're saying that Ukraine should just give Putin whatever he wants without a fight? Would you suggest the same to resistance fighters fighting against, say, the US? Or is it only Putin who gets to be an imperialist?

[–] [email protected] 4 points 2 years ago

The reality of the situation is that Ukraine can't win this war, and people in eastern Ukraine do not want to be part of Ukraine. The longer this war goes on, the more territory Ukraine will lose. Meanwhile, US played a huge role in creating the conditions for the war. US literally overthrew the government in Ukraine to put in the current regime that would fight a proxy war for them.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 2 years ago (1 children)

If only Ukranians had any choice in this. But *elensky will keep the war going, cause thats what his masters want.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (1 children)

There was an election just last year that Zelenskyy won quite handily.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Won handily on a platform of implementing the Minsk agreement and normalizing relations with Russia last I checked.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 2 years ago (2 children)

The Minsk agreement died when Russia invaded. Asking Ukraine to follow it now is a cruel joke. As for normalizing relationships, Russia has scuttled that. There's no normalizing relationships with an occupier.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

You are right that the Minsk agreement died when Russia entered the war. But it was in effect for 8 years, and Ukraine refused to implement any part of it. Instead they killed civilians in Donbass.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

It was never in effect on either side. Read over it some time. The separatists didn't keep their promises, the Ukrainian government didn't keep theirs.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 years ago

You are just spewing generalist phrases because you dont know any of the details. Just read the relevant document and we can discuss it point by point, but not like this. OSCE reports are also a good resource.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Why do you feel the need to constantly make comments that are completely at odds with the facts?

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Speaking of facts, where did the claim that his 2019 platform included implementation of the Minsk agreement come from? He has a platform and the only mention of the general subject is the complete return of Ukrainian territory. I've been combing the Internet for statements to the contrary and I'm coming up with nothing.

As for whether what I just said was "at odds with the facts", it was not. Even if he did run on making nice with Russia in 2019, that was three years ago before a wholesale invasion. May I remind you, you were in disbelief with the invasion started. I was pointing out the elephant in the room, that the situation has changed.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

here you go, it's literally like the first hit on google https://theconversation.com/ukraine-window-opens-for-peace-in-the-donbas-after-volodymyr-zelenskiy-agrees-to-election-plan-124605

What you said is absolutely at odds with the facts. There were two separate Minsk agreements, both of which Ukraine ignored at the encouragement of their western sponsors.

And I did think that the war would not make sense for Russia, I gave clear reasoning for why I thought that. Clearly Russia decided that the cost of the war outweighed the alternatives. I'm not sure what elephant you claim to have been pointing to.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 years ago (1 children)

So... that article doesn't support your claim at all. For one, it is from several months after the election. It also doesn't say anything specifically about him supporting the Minsk agreements. It just said that he supported holding elections in the Donbass region after combatants have left the area.

The Minsk agreements are dead. If you want more proof of that, Putin himself made the claim right before rolling tanks into Ukraine in an invasion that had clearly been planned well in advance.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 years ago (1 children)

So, that literally supports my claim in the first paragraph:

As the war in eastern Ukraine drags into its sixth year, all the attempts to end it have so far failed. But in a significant development on October 1, Ukraine’s president, Volodymyr Zelenskiy, announced his provisional agreement to hold local elections in the currently occupied territories of Donetsk and Luhansk, collectively known as Donbas.

That's basically what the Minsk agreement is in case you weren't aware. Minsk agreements are dead now, but Russia and Donbas tried to get them implemented for 8 years.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (2 children)

So again, it was not part of his platform since this came months after his reelection. Also, there was a lot more to both Minsk agreements. Zelenskyy support was hinged on Russia and its proxies getting out of the occupied territories as the primary objective. Clearly Russian proxies have no interest in disarming and Russia has every intention of continuing to occupy Crimea and the Donbass region, if not completely annexing Donbass as well.

[–] [email protected] 3 points 2 years ago

The Minsk agreement is pretty short, so please point out what you mean by "a lot more". I will ignore the rest of your comment because it is just baseless, ideological rambling.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 2 years ago

He very clearly ran on reunification and ending the conflict on Donbas which ultimately meant implementing Minsk agreements. Anybody who knows anything about Ukraine knows this. You have absolutely no clue regarding the subject you're discussing.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Can you please stop spreading this blatant Russian agenda?

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 years ago

I'm stating basic facts regarding the situation. Can you please cope with that in private?