this post was submitted on 28 Aug 2023
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Sorry for the short post, I'm not able to make it nice with full context at the moment, but I want to quickly get this announcement out to prevent confusion:

Unfortunately, people are uploading child sexual abuse images on some instances (apparently as a form of attack against Lemmy). I am taking some steps to prevent such content from making it onto lemm.ee servers. As one preventative measure, I am disabling all image uploads on lemm.ee until further notice - this is to ensure that lemm.ee can not be used as gateway to spread CSAM into the network.

It will not possible to upload any new avatars or banners while this limit is in effect.

I'm really sorry for the disruption, it's a necessary trade-off for now until we figure out the way forward.

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[–] [email protected] 211 points 2 years ago (1 children)

This is sick. Kudos to mods for dealing with this garbage. I hope the posters are all hunted down and punished.

[–] [email protected] 61 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Yeah, the admins deserve all our support on this. Not only to protect themselves as server owners, but to stop the spread. Hopefully a longterm solution will be found soon

[–] [email protected] 19 points 2 years ago

Just like self-isolation when you have a cold - the healthy and wise thing to do.

[–] [email protected] 113 points 2 years ago (2 children)

I think this is a great move until we have something rock solid to prevent this. There are tons of image hosting sites you can use (most of which have the resources to already try to prevent this stuff) so it shouldn’t really cause much inconvenience.

[–] [email protected] 33 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Quality of posts will go up too. There’s a direct correlation with (worse) quality and image posts.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 2 years ago

I prefer image memes, but to each their own.

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[–] [email protected] 23 points 2 years ago

less strain on lemmy servers as well

[–] [email protected] 43 points 2 years ago (2 children)

I know there are automated tools that exist for detection CSAM- given the challenges the fediverse has had with this issue it really feels like it'd be worthwhile for the folks developing platforms like lemmy and mastodon to start thinking about how to integrate those tools with their platforms to better support moderators and folks running instances.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 2 years ago (3 children)

I just shut down my instance because of this attack. Once there are better controls to prevent this, I will stand it back up.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 2 years ago

Yeah, there was a gardening instance run by a great guy who just did the same

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 years ago

What do you think the purpose of these attacks are? The fediverse is so small in the grand scheme that I can only assume the worst.

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[–] [email protected] 35 points 2 years ago

No apologies necessary.

[–] [email protected] 28 points 2 years ago (2 children)

This is really sad and disgusting. It affects the whole platform but especially smaller instances that can't keep up. Despite being a lemm.ee user, I was particularly upset about thegarden.land shutting down because of that spam. It had my favourite gardening community on here.

I really hope this gets sorted out, and the spammers end up where they belong.

[–] [email protected] 14 points 2 years ago

Wait, they shut down? That's sad, they were great

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 years ago

I'd really love to start a small instance just to play host to a couple of niche interests I don't see around yet, but yeah, hearing about this fucked to behavior is making me hold off.

It has a real chilling affect on users, which is so unfortunate for a platform that is mostly made up of well meaning people

[–] [email protected] 26 points 2 years ago

Perfectly fine. People can upload images elsewhere and then just link to them. Most image upload sites will have all those protections in place already. A good stopgap until Lemmy gets those mod tools

[–] [email protected] 24 points 2 years ago (2 children)

This is why we can't have nice things.

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[–] [email protected] 23 points 2 years ago (2 children)

It's honestly sad that some well-intentioned laws can be used to attack online platforms.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I kinda wonder though, how would go about making a law against cp but doesn't hurt small sites like lemm.ee?

[–] [email protected] 21 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago) (6 children)

The issue is that you really can’t. The laws are written specifically to prevent plausible deniability. Because pedos would be able to go “lol a troll sent it to me” and create some doubt in a jury. Remember that (at least in America) the threshold for conviction is supposed to be “beyond a reasonable doubt.” So if laws were focused on intent, all the pedos would need to do is create reasonable doubt, by arguing that they never intended to view/own the CSAM.

This was particularly popular in the Napster/Limewire days, when trolls would upload CSAM under innocuous titles, so people looking for the newest episode of their favorite show would find CSAM instead. You could literally find CSAM titled things like “Friends S10E9” because trolls were going for the shock factor of an innocent person opening a video only for it to end up being hardcore CSAM. Lots of actual pedos tried using the “I downloaded it by accident” defense.

So instead, the laws are written to close that loophole. It doesn’t matter why you have the CSAM. All that matters is you have it. The feds/courts won’t give a fuck if it was due to you seeking it out or if it was due to a bad actor sending it to you.

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[–] [email protected] 22 points 2 years ago (2 children)

This might be a good thread to ask:

Does anyone know if any of the Lemmy apps support direct imgur uploads for Lemmy?

I remember RIF used to do that for reddit back in the day before reddit supported direct image hosting.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 2 years ago* (last edited 2 years ago)

Memmy on iOS uploads to Imgur by default. You just use the upload button.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 years ago

Memmy on iOS does.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 2 years ago (1 children)
[–] [email protected] 8 points 2 years ago (3 children)

spoilerDon't freak out. This image isn't hosted on lemm.ee.

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[–] [email protected] 19 points 2 years ago (2 children)

Did you alert authorities?

[–] [email protected] 17 points 2 years ago (1 children)

I'm going to go out on a limb and say they and all the other instances that were hit with this attack probably did. Which authorities, I don't know. If this instance is hosted in Estonia then probably Estonian authorities, but it's probably being hosted on the cloud so is it REALLY hosted in Estonia? There are a ton of American and EU users so hopefully the FBI and whatever the EU equivalent is. But honestly cybercrimes can get confusing because of the nature of people and hosting being spread out all over the world and it can be hard to even figure out who to report to.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 2 years ago (2 children)

I'm genuinely confused on why it's even happening in the first place but I can't say conspiracies aren't spinning in my head. Stuff like Russia having troll attacks to try and stifle a new Internet trend. Or companies like Facebook and Twitter paying people to do this to instill a boogeyman like fear of federated Internet.

I'm not suggesting they're true, but they're one of many confused thoughts as to what's goin on.

[–] [email protected] 18 points 2 years ago (1 children)

There’s no need to invoke conspiracy. This is entirely possible for a single person to do, and motivations for single people may be very pity even if the consequences are widely visible.

One misguided teenager on a power trip who enjoys how much disruption he can cause is enough for such an effect.

[–] [email protected] 8 points 2 years ago

yeah bitches be spending actual money to destroy a fifteen year old game with bots. it doesn't need to have political motivation.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 2 years ago

Thank you for the efforts you are making. This is a serious situation; more than just dealing with bad actors, you are viewing traumatic images.

Please, for your sanity and well being, prioritize your self care. Things like this linger in the psyche much longer than you would expect.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 2 years ago (2 children)

That's fucking disgusting. Take any measures you can to prevent that shit from being on the site.

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 2 years ago (6 children)

This is a very good decision, I worried about this problem from the very beginning that I learned about the Fediverse. Research must definitely be done to find CSAM detection tools that integrate into Lemmy, perhaps we could make a separate bridge repo that integrates a tool like that easily into the codebase.

I hope every disgusting creature that uploads that shit gets locked up

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[–] [email protected] 15 points 2 years ago (1 children)

People like this are despicable

Mastodon/Lemmy should work together on some tool for this, it would probably make it easier, and they both have problems with it now

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[–] [email protected] 13 points 2 years ago

I think its necesary, no problem.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 2 years ago

That's disgusting! You made the right thing, sorry you admins and mods have to put up with that shit, I hope instance owners that are being attacked are reporting it to local authorities.

[–] [email protected] 11 points 2 years ago

Thank you sir. I appreciate the dedication to the community to subject yourself to the moderation. Hopefully we can squash this before it goes too far, farther than it has anyway..

[–] [email protected] 10 points 2 years ago

This sucks, but given the circumstances it's sadly an understandable and necessary course of action.

[–] [email protected] 10 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Well, that sucks i wanted to share some cute pics i took of my cats

[–] [email protected] 17 points 2 years ago (3 children)

use imgur or imgbb. outsource image hosting.

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[–] [email protected] 9 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Thanks for taking care about that.

Honestly, Im bit confused, I can still see image uploads posts like: https://lemm.ee/post/5858721

I guess I was lucky I didnt see morbid posts, just want to be sure Im safe now. Is it safe enough to just browse lemm.ee local?

[–] [email protected] 10 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Honestly, Im bit confused, I can still see image uploads posts like: https://lemm.ee/post/5858721

That is because that image is hosted on another website, in this case roncobb.net.

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[–] [email protected] 7 points 2 years ago (3 children)

Guessing there's no way to track down the uploaders?

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[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 years ago (1 children)

Are the lemm.ee servers not located in a region that protects online forums from the content that its users post?

[–] [email protected] 17 points 2 years ago (1 children)

It's not just about lemm.ee, the up/down of federation is that stuff from lemm.ee gets copied to all the other federated instances and vice versa. So lemm.ee's region aside, this move tries to help protect the fediverse at large by removing a major distribution hub. It's not a full solution in that regard, but it makes a bad situation incrementally less bad. Other popular instances may end up doing this as well till better tools come about.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 2 years ago

It’s not just about lemm.ee, the up/down of federation is that stuff from lemm.ee gets copied to all the other federated instances and vice versa. So lemm.ee’s region aside, this move tries to help protect the fediverse at large by removing a major distribution hub.

That's a fair point! Thanks!

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