this post was submitted on 17 Feb 2022

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What are your thoughts on green/private cryptos? (lemmy.ml)

submitted 3 years ago by [email protected] to c/[email protected]

13 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Im interested in cryptos, because it could serve as a foundation for an internet funded by people and communities. A crypto that protects people's privacy and has a low energy cost.

But is this enough to make it ethical? Are there other aspects to take into concideration? Or is ethical cryptos possible?

In particular Im looking into Mobilecoin which Signal has integrated into their app.

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[–] kinetix 2 points 3 years ago

That's an interesting premise, that somehow a currency is going to change the nature of how "the internet" is funded. So, none of the world's currencies have done this, but a "currency" that isn't really a currency is going to change around the entire economics of everything online?

There's so many fun presumptions in that notion that it's hard to even start a discussion.

The short answer is no. I think there's more than enough evidence out there that cryptocurrencies will remain niche, and this ridiculous 'web3' notion of every interaction being a transaction will simply just not occur, much as any bros try and wish and argue for it.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 years ago* (last edited 3 years ago)

Besides all the technical issues, there is also a practical issue to consider: crypto currencies are designed to facilitate exchange between complete strangers and thus come with many build in assumptions. These assumptions are usually actively detrimental for local community currencies that depend a lot on shared trust between members (which is pretty much the opposite of cryptocurrencies).

I would suggest you rather look into traditional legal forms of coops and issue a local currency through that. Based on this "analog" foundation you can then use GNU Taler to provide digital payments.

[–] [email protected] -1 points 3 years ago (1 children)

I'll let people smarter than myself answer your questions, but as for Mobilecoin: stay far, far away. It's just Monero, but rebranded for Signal. In addition, if Signal's company ever goes belly-up, so will the coin, instantly.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 years ago* (last edited 3 years ago)

Agreed. IIRC, though they call the currency "carbon-negative" or whatever, they actually just pay some company to plant trees for them. That doesn't make it a 'green currency'.

[–] [email protected] -3 points 3 years ago* (last edited 3 years ago) (3 children)

Cryptocurrencies is the future, one way or another.

We need to get rid of traditional banking, improve the blockchain process and find a way to block mining, then we are much more efficient than traditional banking because you can easily do thousand transactions within milliseconds without depending on external middle mans.

My idea is that Govt. takes over cryptocurrencies and that traditional banks monitor and improve the system. So you still have your bank, the govt is happy because they can monitor potential fraud and we get a more privacy respecting system.

The entire ponzi scheme discussion only stands and falls with mining. If that is out of the equation then we are pretty much ready to go, China uses their app based chain since years, there is no hard cash anymore and it works pretty well.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 3 years ago (1 children)

Digital Yuan is not based on blockchain

[–] [email protected] 0 points 3 years ago* (last edited 3 years ago) (1 children)

It is about the principle, you replace hard cash. Also this is not entirely right since there are plans to integrate a blockchain but right-now there are not much green alternatives.

[–] [email protected] -3 points 3 years ago

Cryptocurrency != digital currency

Digital currency + each transaction encrypted and obscured = cryptocurrency

[+] [email protected] 0 points 3 years ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

[deleted]

[–] [email protected] -1 points 3 years ago (1 children)

Yes, if we just eliminate all the flaws of crypto, crypto is the perfect currency. Just like if we eliminate all the flaws of capitalism, it’s the perfect system.

This community is about green and not capitalism, consumerism, monopolies etc pp. I did explained the major issue and there is no one who actually tried to workaround this, because the system is considerable new and the original proposal was never meant to be abused the way people doing it.

Your own words right...

Can I see your proposal, protocol, research etc to improve it. NOPE, so lets move on.

Even in the future when all bitcoins have been mined, the idea is that miners continue to calculate hashes for the blocks, and that they are compensated for that via transaction fees.

There are some ideas I have like e.g. putting a threshold on it. nVidia had the idea to limit mining trough firmware, with less success but I do not want people abusing every hardware to quickly making a buck on behalf of the environment.

... presumably government involvement would also wish to control the supply of (virtual) currency much like it does today to attempt to control inflation. The mechanism that they’d use for that would look much like mining (just that only they’d be allowed to do it).

Without govt there is abuse, we saw this and without control, inspection the abuse will continue, we have the current dilemma because people scam, and they hide behind the system. I rather trust my bank than you with my money, nothing personal, would say the same about everyone.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 3 years ago (1 children)

I'm surprised at your comment and its willingness to consider cryptocurrency, but I'm not sure that I understand how one might come to the conclusion that the mining portion of it needs to be eliminated. Granted, I am aware of the environmental concerns... but any solution that addresses those concerns will still look alot like mining, only it will have become energy efficient enough that this is no longer a problem.

Even in the future when all bitcoins have been mined, the idea is that miners continue to calculate hashes for the blocks, and that they are compensated for that via transaction fees. If somehow that weren't required (for whatever reason), presumably government involvement would also wish to control the supply of (virtual) currency much like it does today to attempt to control inflation. The mechanism that they'd use for that would look much like mining (just that only they'd be allowed to do it).

Add on to that "traditional bank involvement", and we've basically reinvented the system that we have now... one where there is no privacy, from the government or private corporations, one where they get to meddle in the supply of currency, where that currency is virtual/digital.

[–] [email protected] 0 points 3 years ago (1 children)

There are other technologies than blockchain or bitcoin. Bitcoin is completely inefficient. There are much better coins that are sustainable

[–] [email protected] 0 points 3 years ago

There are much better coins that are sustainable

But, having removed "mining" and privacy from them, what do they have to offer? For that matter, how are they different than the electronic ledgers that banks already currently use?

He didn't just suggest that the blockchain and inefficiency be resolved, but all the other qualities that actually make cryptocurrencies worthwhile.