this post was submitted on 05 Mar 2025
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[–] [email protected] 0 points 6 hours ago (3 children)

None of those airplanes even have similar capabilities. Why do you think the entirety of Europe has ordered so many F-35.

The only alternative is to wait 15+(realistically 20+) years for a 6gen plane from Europe. And with the alliance dying, who knows how much longer it will take now

Rafale and Gripen are more expensive and in many ways, less good. There is a reason why noone is buying them, or even if they did, they still want to buy more F-35.

[–] RaskolnikovsAxe 2 points 1 hour ago

F35 is far more expensive to operate, so you end up paying more over the lifetime if you actually use it.

Of course the other aircraft don't have a bunch of fancy features of the F35, but maybe we don't need them, particularly in light of the US hostility and unpredictability. And the benefit of building our own is a factor as well.

As I undertand it, the F35 has only about 55% readiness and suffers SW problems as well.

The US is not the only game in town, and we need to be clear about that.

[–] [email protected] 2 points 2 hours ago

The gripen is more agile than the f35 and capable of austere landings. Arguably more important traits than the ability to carry American nukes.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 6 hours ago (1 children)

Why do you think the entirety of Europe has ordered so many F-35.

The reason for Germany is that other aircraft, by choice, have not been certified for use with US nuclear weapons.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 3 hours ago* (last edited 3 hours ago)

Nuke capability is irrelevant for most countries(rafale has a nuke capable variant, though only for French nukes). Take a look at its operators

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_F-35_Lightning_II_operators

Everyone who can get it(allied to the US), has already ordered it or will soon. The only exceptions are Sweden and France, who wanted to maintain some degree of strategic independence and not lose their jet fighter building capability. And Spain, though Spain was also kinda thinking of getting F-35 too(before Trump).

Canada was like Sweden and France, they could manufacture capable planes. But this is immensely expensive. Thats why Canada(and most countries) stopped doing it. This is why the F-35 is cheap, economies of scale, and why countries are willing to wait 5+ years to get it(while rafale and Gripen are basically readily available).

Europe wanted to coast through 5gen planes by using the F-35 while skipping ahead and developing, 2 completely different apparently, 6gen planes by 2040ish.