this post was submitted on 23 Feb 2025
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Not smugposting. Shit sucks. :(

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[–] [email protected] 183 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (7 children)

Our conservatives aren't literal Nazis. And yeah, the actual literal Nazis at 20% is horrifying but it's not like they're going to be part of the government. It's going to be a coalition between the conservatives from the Union and the allegedly social democratic Social Democratic Party. If there's majority for that they'll add the vaguely progressive Greens to the mix.

Meanwhile the US has turned itself into a Nazi broligarchy.

We can still be smug. Sorry America.

Edit: and yes, this post is heavy on copium.

[–] [email protected] 42 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Basically, the CDU/CSU is comparable to the US Democrats, and the AfD is comparable to the Republicans: racist, xenophobe misgonysts.

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[–] [email protected] 21 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (4 children)

Our conservatives aren't literal Nazis.

And yeah, the actual literal Nazis at 20% is horrifying but it's not like they're going to be part of the government.

Meanwhile... Meloni, Duda, Orban, the RN, and the AfD are all already part of their respective governments...

This is fine. Surely.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 5 days ago (1 children)

AfD is being excluded from governing, no one wants to make a coalition.

Unless I'm about to check the news and see the cordon broken...

[–] [email protected] 5 points 5 days ago

The cordon was already broken, it was taped back in a hurry because FDP did not make it to 5%.

If the useful idiots from bsw had voted for AfD, or if FDP had reached the 5% mark, we would get CDU+AfD coalition. Or am I supposed to trust that poor excuse of a human being called Merz?

[–] [email protected] 13 points 5 days ago

AfD is not going to be part of the gov as it stands, and Orbán is going out next year as things are.

We are trying to fight back.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 5 days ago

The RN is not part of the government.

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[–] [email protected] 27 points 5 days ago

Yeah, I remember when we were telling ourselves the nazis would never govern. I was so confident I brought a nice cigar and bottle of scotch to the watch party. I never did smoke that cigar, but I went through that whole bottle nearly on my own and had to sleep it off on my friend’s couch.

[–] [email protected] 15 points 5 days ago

Can I just jump in here and say "broligarchy" is now my new favourite term

[–] [email protected] 3 points 4 days ago

Any headway a far-right party gets in Germany is extra bad because of your history - you should know better more than anyone else. It would be inadvisable to be smug, because you're heading in the same direction we are.

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[–] [email protected] 140 points 5 days ago (5 children)

Let's be clear, if you're American, British, Canadian, French or now German, there's an operation at foot to promote hard right extremes and disrupt your country. True of probably most of the world, really, even if it hasn't fully taken root in your country.

Ultimately, yes, we're in this together so no matter what your anger (or smugness level) is, keep in mind nothing good comes from other-ing those on the same side of history as you.

[–] [email protected] 28 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Theres also Romania, who almost elected a pro-russian right-wing extremist, and Moldova, whose citizens have been bribed to vote against joining the EU

[–] [email protected] 5 points 5 days ago

Realistically Moldova shouldn't be in the EU anyway. There are quite a few countries that have been admitted into the European Union that really shouldn't have been. Nations with economic instability (for whatever reason) joining the single market only caused problems for the single market.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 4 days ago

The people posting denigrating memes and sparking those rage-filled threads are the trash of the Earth. Infighting helps absolutely nobody.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (1 children)

Right-Wing parties are not in power in any of those countries except America. Sure there is a plan to try and promote right-wing ideologies in those countries they're always is a plan to promote right-wing ideologies it's what the right wing is for.

[–] [email protected] 13 points 5 days ago (1 children)

I'm not just referencing the growth of their parties but also stupid decisions like Brexit. And it's not necessarily just right wing, but also adversaries who benefit from our division. You can't deny the existence of Russian and Chinese bot farms.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 5 days ago

If anything I would think that the UK is less likely to make right-wing decisions now than it was 10 years ago. Precisely because we got to see how much of a fuck up they were.

Existence of bot farms isn't really indicative of anything they've existed for years now long before Trump

[–] [email protected] 4 points 4 days ago* (last edited 4 days ago)

You're right. If you see the world not as a conflict between nation states but as a class war all of this makes a lot more sense. This is not to say that nation states don't matter. They are absolutely still used by the ruling class to maintain order and justify their actions as a "defense of our nation and culture". Fascism has no hard rules or ideologies. It is used to defend capitalist interests and power. It is why we are seeing the rise in far right politics in the west.

The capitalist class does not know borders; it knows class interest. Fascism is the defense of this interest in the face of capitalism internal contradictions.

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[–] [email protected] 54 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (7 children)

The AfD is the German version of the present day US Republicans and they only got 20% of the vote, not won both a Presidency (which in Germany is mainly a symbolic post) and an absolute majority in the Bundestag (roughly, their Congress).

Further, just like the effects of Brexit on the UK cooled down for at least a decade the anti-EU sentiment in the rest of Europe, what Trump and the Republicans are doing with the power they got in the US is likely to (once enough of the side effects of his actions pile up) cool down any love for that kind of Fascism in the rest of the West.

The Far Right has an ideological framework of purelly criticizing/complaining/accusing, which is great when you're an observer sitting on the sidelines and shouting about how those who are actually doing things are doing it all wrong, but doesn't at all work when they're in a position where they actually need to do things themselves, so they invariably fuck things up badly, generally because over the mid and long term the side effects of their actions completelly wipe-out any positive direct effects those actions were expected to have and then remain active and further destroying for far longer than the positive effects do.

IMHO, the danger for the rest of the West is far more that Elon and Trump start WWIII, than that people in other countries will be inspired to follow their ideology by seeing what they do with it in the US.

(The danger for the US, which I suspect is pretty much guaranteed since both major parties there have sided with the Pillager segment of society, is the country will be firmly and forever dethroned from its position as super power within a decade)

[–] [email protected] 19 points 5 days ago (1 children)

There is something that happens when fascism's failures become increasingly obvious. They don't necessarily lose power. What they do is insist that the problem is that they weren't cruel enough so far.

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[–] [email protected] 18 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago) (1 children)

The CDU guy who's about to be chancellor is the classic "economically liberal, anti regulation, blame foreigners for all violence" far right who pretends he's not far right by taking the head of a party that keeps helping the far right rhetoric, instead of straight up joining the far right party, for some reason. He's been mad at Merkel for 20 years because she sidelined him in the party because he was too much further right. He's not Musk, but he's the guy who keeps making sure Musk and Trump never get shut down.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

Well, then it might very well be that the effects of Trump's policies did not manifest themselves on time to sway Germans away from the Far-Right.

Having lived through Brexit, I still very much expect that what Trump is now doing in the US will fuckup most of the Far-Right in Europe. This belief is also anchored on what we are now seeing in countries which were "ahead of the curve" in bringing the Far-Right into Government, such as Poland, who are now turning away from it as well as things like the recent, sudden and somehow unexpected growth of the (real) Leftwing reversing the trend of moving to the Right in places like Finland.

I expect that, given its much greater economic dominance, size and footprint of reporting about it in of the media space, the example of the US will be far more visible and impactful in the general population of Europe than the examples of Hungary, Poland or Finland.

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[–] [email protected] 32 points 4 days ago (1 children)

Tbf afd didn't win a plurality, they will almost certainly not be in government.

Its likely CDU + SPD

afd got about 20%

Its concerning tho, since NSDAP got 18.3% in 1930, and just 2 years later, they became the biggest party and won a plurality of seats in 1932 and a year later win 43.9% of the seats with hitler becoming chancellor

[–] [email protected] 7 points 4 days ago

The 1933 elections were unfree, and within the two election 1932 they dropped from 37.4 to 33.1. Still not enough votes to pass the enabling act so they arrested SPD+KPD politicians and then used a simple majority to change the quorum rules such that the absent votes would not count against them.

It's fascinating how much legal theatre they did to give a legalistic paint job to their power grab. Completely different to Trump, more like corporate lawyers.

[–] [email protected] 22 points 4 days ago (2 children)

The German results are more like the US in 2004. If they are headed to the same fate they are 20 years behind us.

[–] [email protected] 12 points 4 days ago (1 children)

They are two completely different countries, with completely different histories.

[–] [email protected] 16 points 4 days ago (1 children)

Indeed. In many other ways Germany is 200 years ahead of the USA.

[–] [email protected] 5 points 4 days ago (2 children)

I wonder if America survives this, the experience of Fascists first-hand might galvonize us against it like it did Germany... That said, the fact they have a resurgence in Germany is more than a little concerning.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 4 days ago (1 children)

More worryingly, it’s not just Germany.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 4 days ago

It is every country where Russia spread propaganda and misinformation

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 days ago

We didn't learn our lesson after Nixon, Regan, Bush Jr. Or trump first term.

I see no reason to hope that will change. The Democratic party operates more like a ratchet than a true alternative. The Republicans lurch us to the right and the Democrats ratchet is back a bit to the left and pat themselves on the back.

[–] [email protected] 7 points 4 days ago (1 children)

Thats not at all how politics and fascism works. Germany is not isolated from the rest of the world and in some time capsule. It's definitely not "like the US in 2004" because we're living in 2025. And it's not just AFD. Even the greens are fear mongering over immigrants. Germany wasn't somehow isolated from the rise in islamophbia since 2001. They have been a major part of that and are talking about Muslims like they are Jews in 1930s Germany.

Fascism doesn't have a 20 year lag. It very often arises in major world powers at the same time. This is due to it being a defensive response of the capitalist class in class conflict. What is happening in the US is also happening in Germany.

[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 days ago

The parallels are stark, but the German results are less worrying to me than the American.

Maybe I will be wrong in a month or a year, but so far the Germans are in the "unhappy with the system, try the other major party" stage rather than the "burn it all down and give it to the strongman" stage we find ourselves in here in America.

[–] [email protected] 57 points 5 days ago

They're in better shape than we are. Their conservative government probably won't be in a coalition with, much less led by, the Nazis. But yeah. Shit sucks.

[–] [email protected] 44 points 5 days ago (1 children)

I agree, this shit sucks. But CDU isn't really comparable to the GOP. AfD might be.

[–] [email protected] 48 points 5 days ago (1 children)

AfD just secured their strongest election result in history, I think that’s what OP is referring to

[–] [email protected] 29 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Yes, but they're not (yet) in power. At least at federal level. This still sucks donkey balls.

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[–] [email protected] 31 points 5 days ago* (last edited 5 days ago)

I've been commenting this on a lot of memes in that vein, it was plainly obvious from the German polls and the various EU-countries that got a rightwing government in recent years.

Yeah, shit sucks.

[–] NoxAstrum 9 points 5 days ago (4 children)

Are americans aware that the vast majority of Europe is not German?

[–] [email protected] 8 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Yeah, I'm also aware that the right's been on the rise in Denmark, France, Italy, and the Netherlands at a minimum. The UK seems to have taken a moment to catch their breath, but I'm not convinced that they're completely over it.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 4 days ago

The right also already won elections in Sweden and Finland, and Austria ... they already had a far right party in the government in the 00's.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 4 days ago

The European Union is literally just the Holy Roman Empire 2. You're all German whether you like it or not. And yes, you canadians are also European since you are still beholden to The Forsaken Queen.

[–] [email protected] 4 points 4 days ago

Not yet

but if afd wins, y'all have to speak german becuase... gestures at history 👀

[–] [email protected] 9 points 5 days ago (1 children)

Didnt know Weidel was elected Chancellor.

[–] [email protected] 6 points 5 days ago (2 children)

Eh, Fritze is just slightly better…

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[–] [email protected] 1 points 3 days ago

Germany voted for CDU/CSU, more akin to the Democrats. The Republican equivalent would be the Nazi party AfD.

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