I consider this a Christophany
this post was submitted on 09 Mar 2025
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Thank you for sharing. I am really fascinated by Old Testament stories in which God occurs as a person. When I read that I remember Gen 18. God makes himself visible to Abraham in the shape of three men. Personally I quite like the presumption that you theoretically could meet God in a person you meet but don't expect it. Reminds me on that verse in Matthew (I think) where Jesus said: What you have done to my brother, you have done to me.
So where exactly does it mention Jesus?
IT DOES NOT!
Hence the question marks! I would love your take on this passage!
Seeing as "God is a spirit and hath not a body like a man", as it says in the children's catechism, it is interesting that Jacob was able to wrestle with him in such a physical manner.
How would you explain this?
If the passage doesn't mention JC then it's probably not about JC. A mid 19th century post hoc explanation of the trinity isn't going to actually change that.
That's a very unreformed/uninformed answer! There are many places in the New Testament where the writers very clearly state that an Old Testament passage was referring to Jesus Christ, even though those passage don't mention Jesus Christ by name. The New Testament is absolutely brimming with them. Way before the 19th century, and way too many to account for by irresponsibly throwing out the word "edits" so don't try that
You're quipping about making stuff up while supporting a book whose primary evidence for taking it remotely seriously is itself?
The count of occurrences isn't evidence of authenticity or truthfulness.
I don't know what you mean about "authenticity," but between Homer's writings, Plato's writings, and the Bible (OT & NT separately) the NT has:
- best manuscript quality
- earliest complete manuscripts relative to composition
And the OT and NT together have:
- most archaeological verification
This when compared to the works of Plato & Homer (we don't need to mention Socrates because he doesn't have any written work preserved at all). They are as authentic, and moreso in some areas, as any ancient writing.
As to truthfulness, I've already spoken archaeologically, but referring to the spiritual content, I wouldn't presume to convince you.
This is Reformed Theology. There is a passage in Romans 9 that is very unpopular these days, but we embrace it. It goes like this:
Romans 9:11-18 NIV
Yet, before the twins were born or had done anything good or bad—in order that God’s purpose in election might stand: not by works but by him who calls—she was told, “The older will serve the younger.”
Just as it is written: “Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.”
What then shall we say? Is God unjust? Not at all! For he says to Moses, “I will have mercy on whom I have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I have compassion.” It does not, therefore, depend on human desire or effort, but on God’s mercy.
For Scripture says to Pharaoh: “I raised you up for this very purpose, that I might display my power in you and that my name might be proclaimed in all the earth.”
Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy, and he hardens whom he wants to harden.
I do want you to know, I hope God has mercy on you. Along with Paul,
I pray that the eyes of your heart may be enlightened in order that you may know the hope to which he has called you, the riches of his glorious inheritance in his holy people, and his incomparably great power for us who believe.
Ephesians 1:18-19a NIV
By your logic, most historical document's primary evidence for taking it remotely seriously is "itself".